Monday, July 23, 2012

Will They, Or Won't They?

Suppose the police in your city or town were replaced/bolstered by fully-armed US Marines?

We've had this conversation here before, but the enclosed article shows the topic may become even more important as we get closer to the election. So important IMO, that it will have a very direct effect on all our lives.

Many Americans believe the Marxist-in-Chief, seeing that he's losing the election, will resort to "highly drastic, extreme, and unheard of " measures to control the population, under the guise of some kind of "national emergency ", when they realize he refuses to surrender his power/office. And, he'll use, not local or state police, but the US military to do it. Does the POTUS have that authority? I'm not 100% sure, but for a guy who routinely ignores congress and the Constitution, why not.

I know my good buddy Steve believes that in such a case, the military will not go against the people. My opinion has been, and continues to be; the military are trained to obey orders, and will do so. Perhaps not all of them, but enough. Personally, i would bet on local and state police refusing to act in that scenario faster than i'd bet on our military, especially units "specifically trained " to control the civilian population.

Under normal conditions, this would be seen as a rather bizarre, even insane, conversation. But, we're living in crazy times, in a nation that's becoming crazier with each day. We're seeing things taking place that many of us believed we'd never see in our America. But IMO, the America that we remember is quickly disappearing. Perhaps, in what replaces it, seeing armed US Marines patrolling your streets will become the norm. God forbid...


Schteveo said...

They are trained to obey orders. LAWFUL Orders. And pacifying the entire country, under some trumped up BS, "...I'm the CinC, so I get to decide what's Lawful...", scenario doesn't fit.

Here's the biggest deal, the 'troops' won't GET the orders to start with, anymore than YOU got orders straight from Gracie Mansion. In order for the 'troops' to get any orders to take over the country for OUR own good and safety, the Pentagon would take the orders from the Chump in Chief, and send it out to the troops.

They won't do it. They'd resign first. And that jug eared twit would have to appoint a new set of Joint Chiefs. Who would then, resign, instead of following illegal orders. What you think the military would do, is akin to Mayor Bloomberg telling his 'troops' to go into "X" Borough and start confiscating guns, because he 'says' there's a general danger to the city.

He has no authority to do so, and I'm betting the guys just below him KNOW they have no authority to carry out that order. He can create a Curfew, or reroute traffic, or keep people from entering or leaving a few blocks if there's a real problem. but even then, his authority is not absolute.

Neither is jug ears authority, and the Joint Chiefs know what he can tell them to do and what he is forbidden to do. Listen, I was not any kind of person who would ever have been put on the streets in a problem situation. And I was still taught about the Posse Comitatus Act, and WHY it existed and what the limits were, from the newest recruit, to the guy at the WH.

And guess what, the Marines in that unit, know it too. BTW, the Army and AF already have those units. This is catch up for the USMC.

Cowpill said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

Here's something the EnviroNazi's won't tell you.

Spider said...

So my friend, what you're saying is that you would expect a coup from the top military leaders if Obummer gave them orders to put-down any "civil unrest"? Keep in mind that the Dept. of Homeland Stupidity has already classified people like us as "terrorists".

And, if Obummer framed it that way, (especially if some of us take to the streets carrying our loaded 2nd-Amendment rights) would that be an unlawful order?

As is always the case, if things are presented in a "nice, seemingly legal package", as the Left have become masters at doing, do you still think the Top Brass would balk? (rhetorical question, as i know you do)

On this, we agree to disagree.

Schteveo said...

NO, NO, NO, no. Read what I said.

If he trumps up something...let's say, he goes on TV tonight and announces that they've 'discovered' that Homes was just the tip of a huge uprising iceberg. And he announces that he's taking emergency measures to disarm EVERYONE. We've got 48 hours to turn in our guns.

48 hours go by we don't comply.

Friday night he goes on TV and says he JUST signed an emergency order that we be FORCIBLY disarmed. He's JUST sent the order to the Pentagon , for Martial Law.

They'd tell him to piss up a robe.

Even THIS President wouldn't get the Joint Chiefs to follow him that blindly. If the order violates the Constitution, it's ILLEGAL and you can ignore it, meaning they wouldn't pass it on.

It's not worth arguing over, and here's why, chapter and verse, from the UCMJ, pertaining to an Article 92 - Failure to Obey an Order or Regulation.

In the Explanation section, so that we know what is a lawful order and who can give it, it says,
(c) A general order or regulation is lawful unless it is contrary to the Constitution, the laws of the United States, or lawful superior orders or for some other reason is beyond the authority of the official issuing it. See the discussion of lawfulness in paragraph 14c(2)(a).
So they are given an out. If not for that part of Article 92, every rotten cocksucker over a buck private or bottom level jerk, could start a LEGAL insurrection. Or his next level superior could force him to do damned near anything.

Do LEOs not have similar set ups?

Spider said...

Yes, LEO's are sworn to defend the Constitution, and (in the NYPD anyway) there's a rule that says you need not obey "an unlawful command". I'd seen it happen a few times over the years, and in fact, had occasion to be in that situation myself. The order given me was a clear violation of the NYPD's rules and just might have opened me up to criminal charges had i complied. The order was then goven to, and carried out by someone else. Being right cost me 15 days pay.

And yes, i understand the UCMJ. My point was, in a time of "national emergency", even a fake one, i still believe they (most) would follow orders "to a certain degree". We've seen many large riots in this country over the years where the military (National Guard) had to be called in, fully armed, to stop the violence and maintain order among the civilian population. They did it.

Where i do agree with you is if things get really out of hand, and they're told to fire on citizens. At that point, i think they would refuse.