Wednesday, November 26, 2008

A question for our liberal guest;

Happy Liberal Freak has made the claim many times that the last 30 years of conservative rule has left us “teetering on the brink,” but has still taken no effort, despite my entreaties otherwise, to back up his claims with facts, figures, and examples, besides pointing out that the small majority of the last 30 years have witnessed a republican majority of some sort.

By totally ignoring the fact that the last thirty years have been, by FAR, the most prosperous years in the history of our nation, and by pointing out the fact that we are only just now beginning to drop into recession, he claims that the republicans have scuttled this country. He seems to be very interested in reduction ad absurdum arguments that cast conservatives in a ridiculous light. As I recall, he compared conservatives to two year olds screaming “MINE!”

I have asked this same question twice now, and have been totally ignored by our friend, and so I will ask it in this format, where there is no excuse to “miss” it, and see if he is brave enough to respond.

Before I ask the question, I will lay out a few ground rules to the answer:

1.) No fallacious arguments. To say that our problems now are caused simply because the republicans held a majority for the last 30 years is a post hoc fallacy. Simply because something happened before something else, does not make it the cause. By your argument, I get to claim the last 30 years of exploding prosperity in our country for the Republicans, which, in my opinion, pretty much makes up for the next couple years (at most) when times are going to be hard.

2.) Cite specific examples of Republican policies that have created this problem.

3.) Discuss why you do not believe that 100% of the blame for our current housing and banking industry collapse should not be laid at the feet of Democrats like Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, and Bill Clinton, for passing the laws and rules that allowed and encouraged completely irresponsible lending practices.

4.) Discuss why any of this collapse is the Republican’s fault.

5.) Discuss why, when the Republicans saw this problem, and tried to do something about it 2 years ago, the Democrats blocked the action.

6.) Explain how, with the preponderance of the evidence pointing the finger at Democratic “give away” policies for our current crisis, you feel as thought it is Republican conservatism that has caused our problem.

These should be pretty simple things to answer given your intellectual superiority over everyone else on this site (which is pretty impressive, given the fact that we have several engineers, a couple of doctors, and a good portion of the readership with IQs over 135, so good for you!).

514 comments:

1 – 200 of 514   Newer›   Newest»
CTjayhawker said...

insert Jeopardy theme here

Anonymous said...

Goo-Bar,

Beat ch'all tew et. Check my cut and paste job in the last post. And quit being so nice to that liberal douche gargler. I'm not like McCain. When I 'reach across the aisle' its with a 55 grain haller-pernt goin bout 3250 fps.

Sheet, I'd cap'em as much as let'em eat a Sifty AIDs Drippin Chancre Schlong

got it?

Anonymous said...

Well, right off the bat, my post last night in the other thread blows away most of your list. It explains why Fannie & Freddie were not the cause of our problems. But either you can't read or refuse to see evidence that contradicts your slouded, backwards view of the world.

More to come later. Must get to work. My shift at KFC starts soon.

Anonymous said...

Don't lie to me Douche Gargler, you couldn't GET a yob at KFC. Admit it, you live in Seattle and are a Barista at StarBux.

Anonymous said...

Oha, and one more. Provide examples of this "government deregulation" that folks from your persuasion are always crowing about, because I don't seem to be able to find one example of the government de-regulating the housing or finiancial market, besides the democratically-sponsored CRA.

I'm interested to hear your rebuttal, and since, I, too have a pretty demanding job, I'll understand if it takes you a while to get all of this down in writing.

Thanks for indulging my curiosity on how your world view became so different from mine.

Anonymous said...

Snorpht;

Calm down, man. You get upset and start spewing hate and drivel, and he wins. You see, liberals love to paint us as bitter people who cling to our religion and guns, as opposed to what we are, which is people interested in freedom to choose and do as we please, without government fiat and intervention, so long as our actions do not impinge upon the rights of others.

The difference between us is simple. I want to take care of myself, and liberals want the government to take care of everybody. THey never moved beyond the phase where they had a constant caretaker, and cannot understand the desire for self-determination.

They say greed. I say personal responsibility. THey say social responsibility, I say nanny state. They say, "feel sorry for the less fortunate" and I say, I've worked my aching ass off my entire life, coming from a background where my family lived in a 21 foot broken down motor home for 8 months because we had no place to live, to where I am today, which is middle class with health insurance and enough money to cover expenses. I say, if I can do it, so can they. They chose not to, so why is that my responsiblity?

It is a difference in opinion, and differences in opinion do not justify violence or threats thereof. They simply invite discussion.

If HLF chooses to continue on his previously stated path of degradation, misrepresentation, and name-calling, then this will be my last coorespondence with him, as he is obviously incapable of discussing differences without making it personal, and I have no time for such childishness.

I expect better from him, and everyone on this site, including you.

However, i'm sure you don't give a damn about what i just said, and that's why I respect you.

Anonymous said...

O GooBar, this guy is a Douche Gargler, I don't care WHAT he thinks. All I see is a liberal I want to KILL...... Imaginatively and slowly.
I want to starve the little puke. Then lop off his nuts and give'm to Missy to saute with onions in front of this turd till he's insane with hunger. Then feed'nm to him to him and video tape him eating his own gonads on my new HD camcorder.

And piss on religion I just want to cling to my guns and reach out across the aisle w/a .223 at 3 times the speed of sound.

Negotiate.... shit. I say EXTERMINATE. Bury'm and soak the ground with Douche Squeezins.

Gets the Pitcha? Don't be a Puss GooBar. Kill, Kill, Kill!!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

There. I think I just had one.......

GizPoots

Anonymous said...

Goober, it's going to be hard to debate these points if you insist on not reading what I link. Several of those links do a terrific job of refuting the role of the CRA in the housing meltdown.

I will not spend my free time banging out intelligent rebuttals to conservative ignorance only to have you stick you fingers in your ears and not listen. Once you prove to me that you've read the links, I will give you what you seek, which, is largely already posted within those links.

PS. Most of you ARE bitter, nasty, mean-spirited miscreants like Snorpht. Jimbo also comes to mind. It's like you're missing some genes or something tha makes you less than human.

Anonymous said...

I have an IQ 142 and am in no way the most intelligent person on this site. Maybe that explains why I tend to be the most liberal...

Hey Snorpht, what say we go out to desert east of AJ this weekend and send a few rounds down range. I haven't clung to my guns in months.

Anonymous said...

I work in an industry directly related to the housing market (not a bank or lender) and we saw the collapse coming 3+ years ago. I don't care what people write, the entire collapse of the economy came from banks lending money to people they knew couldn't pay it back, people getting "interest only" loans and "house flippers" who got caught with multiple houses they couldn't sell and couldn't pay the mortgages on.

Once the banks couldn't rely on this income source, everything collapsed.

Point the finger all you want but the point is, if it doesn't get fixed we're screwed.

Anonymous said...

29er, OK......lets dew it.
I been itchin to git out wit my new Smith & Wesson AR15. Been practice'n field stripping it and now I'm ready to clean all the factory protective gunk off it and give it its first proper gun oil bath to go out and shoot that mutha. Scored 10 boxes of Remington .223 for $9.99ea at Outdoor World last Sat. Although I may buy a 1,000 round case from AMMOMAN.com

We can meet at my place. I live in Las Sendas @ Power & Thomas.

Hey, Douche Gargler. Yes YOU, HLF! You talk like a broad. Are you a broad or just wanna be one? You wanna go out and throw some lead in the desert you prolapsed rekdum you?

Anonymous said...

Duhh...my IQ is 'fish'.

Anonymous said...

Power and Thomas?

we can just shoot from your back porch then...

Anonymous said...

HLF;

Linking the liberal sites that you linked would be akin to my linking world net daily to prove a point to you.

YOu would ignore that link just like I ignored your links. Turn about is fair play.

Provide explanation in your own type, please, not links to other liberal mouthpieces.

That said, did you read the article that Snorpht copied over in the previous posting? It pretty much refuted everything your "links" claimed.

I am talking unbiased news organizations, which, from what I can find, pretty much unanimously point the finger at democrats and democratic policies for our current crisis.

If you chose to not respond with anything other than links to liberal mouthpiece sites, then I have no choice but to tell you that I am unconvinced.

How would you feel if I just linked WND? i think you would be likewise unconvinced.

As far as Jimbo and Snorpht are concerned, they are both good people, you just pissed them off with your childish manner in previous posts, where you had sort of a jubilant name-calling demeanor about your posts, whether you meant it or not.

They aren't as forgiving and understanding as some on here. I'll forgive a few moments of intemperance so long as they are backed up with moments of clarity and truth.

Give it a shot. Convince me. Only, do it without links to Kos and Huffington (for example).

Anonymous said...

That is correct 29. But the culprit is not F&F though they were involved. The real culprit is Wall Street colluding with the mass market lenders like Countywide or IndyMac to go out and create as many loans as possible for bundling up into CDOs and MBEs so that they could split them into risk tranches and sell them off. Then there was the rating agencies and risks models that were nothing short of fraudulent.

F&F saw themselves losing market share to those entities and decided to jump in the cesspool to stay in business.

But to blame poor people is wrong. To blame liberals for somehow "forcing banks to lend to the undeserving is completely wrong.

The Community Reinvestment Act does not contain provisions forcing any bank to loan to any certain people. It was created to stop red-lining, the practice of a bank taking deposits from an areaa and then not loaning to people in that area. After all, those deposits were from the people in that area. CRA simply said that, if you have a bank in neighborhood X where the depositors live in neighborhood X, you must give a certain percentage of loans to people living there. The loans don't have to be mortgage loans. Sounds reasonable to normal people.

I find it totally reugnant that conservatives would once again attempt to blame the lower end when in fact it was the greed of the upper end that caused this mess. Let's also not forget that plenty of rich and middle class people bought houses they couldn't afford and are in default.

Let me know if my description of the CRA is accurate.

Anonymous said...

The links were not Kos or HuffPost. One was from a Nobel Prize winning columnist from the NY Times. One was the Idaho Statesman, another the OC register, two fairly conservative papers. One was Slate Magazine. All the links used real data and facts to back up their assertions.

You can reject those outlets as liberal and ridiculously try and equate them with World Net Daily (!!!) which is something I'd expect from a low-intellect conservative.

The only sources that blame democrats are nutjobs sites like WND, Drudge and FOX.

You will not be receiving anything from me that came from my own research or knowledge since I am not an economist with a background in these issues. Even your candidate McCain admitted as much.

We're at an impasse unlikely to be broken. you will reject accepting any blame for your party though they did control the government during the bubble (2000-2007).

It's how you people are. As long as one democrat is still standing you'll blame him/her for your failures. It's a childish attitude that gets us nowhere. Honestly, it's why I hate conservatives so much. They're bullies and weasels who have slimey habits of grabbing credit and deflecting blame, never seeing the flaws in themselves. It;i not admirable to be like that in everyday life or in politics. We've all worked with people like that and we all hate them.

Anonymous said...

Mirable Dictu D-G'er. What nonsnese
I still say you're a broad.

29er, not many years ago I could have.

Spider said...

Have you caught on yet Goob? Has it dawned on you that you're talking to your self? Have you noticed your points being laughed at? Being part liberal yourself, i would've thought you could spot this leftist con-artist and realize what he/she/it is doing.

The only people that should deal with assholes are proctologists. Are you a proctologist Goob?

Anonymous said...

In middle school they gave me an IQ test which came back at 148. So they said that I couldn't put together a coherent sentence. How could that be? So they tested me again and it came back 151!. Must have been my public skool edumakashun in brooklyn that broke that particular set of neurons.

But I can THINK

And like most of the folks here, I pulled myself up from humble lower middle class beginnings, with no gov't help, to achieve what I have. It seems odd that most liberal do-gooders came from upper middle class or wealthy families (I'm not talking about inner city types, but suburbans who never saw a minority, much less spoke with one). These people have no concept of reality. How much volunteering or charity work have these folks done?

Ringing doorbells for obama does not count


Tell them to

Anonymous said...

and Snorpht: that's HiLF, not MILF

Anonymous said...

"Being part liberal yourself"

Ouch, Spider, i think you spelled "libertarian" wrong...

:)

Spider said...

I don't know bud. Sometimes you have me wondering. But at least you're rational.

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